At What Cost...

[MarkB 4]

This evening no less than 3 police vehicles (including van and 5-6 burly policemen), Fire engine and full crew and 2 female RSPCA officers in 2 vans came into Gobowen (1 Old Whittington Road) and the outcome was the arrest of John Spicer (Barefooted,for cruelty to animals) and the seizure of his 2 dogs.

On top of this a team of 2 boarding up specialists came from Shrewsbury to secure the premises with ,GET THIS, two pozidrive screws holding door to frame...

 

You get less response than this from the authorities if your house was burgled or somebody was reported for mistreating their children.

I would like to know the exact cost of this operation and who foots the bill...

 

We all know that mistreatment of animals is not on but anybody that knows John (Im sure youve all seen him around the village with his dogs) sees just how much he loves those animals and would not purposfully mistreat them under any circumstances. Yes the one dog is very long in the tooth (15-16years)and shows extreme signs of old age but the other younger dog is in exceptionally good health.

 

Surely there are other ways...

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Simple Simon 36]

Yes, I saw a Fire Engine parked at the bottom of the road and wondered what was going on. Later on I saw the van and 2 police cars parked outside John's house. 

 

Very sad...

 

I saw John earlier in the day. It looked as if he'd been shopping because he'd left some bags outside his front door and was carrying his old dog (which was in a very poor state) across the road from the Working Men's Club yard.

 

I'm guessing he was warned by the authorities about the conditions he was letting his dogs live in and he resisted, but that doesn't excuse this apparent heavy handed approach.

[MarkB 4]

 

I'm guessing he was warned by the authorities about the conditions he was letting his dogs live in and he resisted, but that doesn't excuse this apparent heavy handed approach.

 

Yes Simon I think you might be right... John has certainly been visited by RSPCA Officers 3 times that i know of recently but all they did was push a card through the door after not speaking to him directly. I know this because Ive spoken to John about it...

I suppose it was the final straw when not getting a reply yesterday BUT it was certainly a heavy handed approach from the authorities.

I was also under the impression that when we had the vermin problem in Old Whittington Road, 3-4 years ago, the local authorities were going to monitor Johns situation with follow up visits and help if required. If this had been carried out accordingly then this incident might not have arisen.

[Simple Simon 36]

I get the feeling that, as usual, one department wasn't talking to another and it was a bit of a kok up...that, or cut backs.

[MarkB 4]

Well Im sure most would have now seen the report about Johns plight in the Advertizer... The local community in and around the centre of the village, especially those in Old Whittington Road, have been almost fully united in support of John and also in condemning the authorities very heavy handed tactics. The RSPCA refuted any claims that John was not treated with respect however those who witnessed the police putting an elderly 71 year old man into the back of a police van barefooted, without allowing him to put shoes upon his feet, think otherwise. John asked about both his shoes and his glasses(required to read paperwork at police station)but he was refused them both. John was kept in custody for a full 24 hours before being released without any charges or bail conditions being enforced by the police.

If this is how the RSPCA and police treat a mild mannered and well behaved 71 year old pensioner upon arrest then I would not like to see them being disrespectful during an arrest...

It looks like the story is now going National... The Daily Mail have been running a campaign about the RSPCA and their heavy handed tactics and they have now got hold of Johns story and reporters have visited Gobowen today to interview locals.

Radio 4 have also been in touch...

John has asked me to Thank all those who have supported him through this difficult time... It is hoped that enough pressure might in some way allow "Little Boy" to be placed back where he belongs, with John...

[Maggie 65]

....and what about his poor old dog that was snatched away and then put down. How frightening was that!  I cannot believe the autocratic way this has been performed.  Why didn't anyone talk to the neighbours first about what was maybe needed? Don't RSPCA realise that there is a mutual relationship between owners and pets, usually based on love and respect on both sides.  It's all well and good to sweep in with guns blazing when intentional cruelty occurs, but in many cases what is needed is support and help for the owners and animals, not this sort of shocking event.  It's all one sided.

[Simple Simon 36]

Let's just cool down here. This is a private man we're talking about on a public network. We don't know the full story. I would agree that it appeared to be heavy handed.

 

Having seen both dogs on a regular basis I know the older of the two could hardly walk, and I know what it feels like to take the decision to have a dog put down....and it's not easy.

[MarkB 4]

 

Let's just cool down here. This is a private man we're talking about on a public network. We don't know the full story. I would agree that it appeared to be heavy handed. 

Having seen both dogs on a regular basis I know the older of the two could hardly walk, and I know what it feels like to take the decision to have a dog put down....and it's not easy.

What is happening is that the locals are doing as much as they can to highlight Johns plight and he is more than happy with that. John asked if I could thank the locals via the forum and keep them up to date with things, he doesnt want non factual things to be banded about which did in fact start to happen.  

[MarkB 4]

Johns story was highlighted in the Daily Mail yesterday (Saturday 20th July), page 15 and Mail comment on page 16.

[MarkB 4]

Next its the Shropshire Star and unbelievably a documentary film maker working for Panorama who will be highlighting Johns story, as well as many other similar incidents with the RSPCA. Both have been in Gobowen and are visiting again Tuesday.

Radio 4 also want to interview John...

Edited July 22, 2013 by MarkB

[Simple Simon 36]

Good grief!

 

There appears to be a problem with the RSPCA.

[justice 0]

I am not a local but have heard of Mr Spicers ordeal at the hands of that so-called charity. The way he has been treated is not a one off so please beware that the r$pca are not to be trusted in any way. Please believe me, they will stoop to any depth (including lying under oath) in order to secure a conviction.

I hope that those of you who witnessed this will stand up and be counted as to his treatment as they will deny they had been anything other than sympathetic. And the police and their 'witnesses' will back them up. They already have a conviction for perverting the course of justice.

Am unable to post links at the moment but google rspca liars or rspca injustice. Will be an eye opener. Also look at the SHG (self help group).

Finally, please let Mr Spicer know that there are people out there who are behind him 100%.

[MarkB 4]

Finally, please let Mr Spicer know that there are people out there who are behind him 100%.

 

Thankyou... John is overwhelmed by the support that has been forthcoming, not only from within the community but also from many who read the Daily Mail article and have been kind enough to drive to Gobowen for a chat with John and share similar experiences they have had at the hands of the RSPCA.

 

 

After writing to the Rt Hon Owen Paterson MP about Johns treatment(Owen has spoken to John on many an occasion whilst in Gobowen) I was informed, only yesterday, that Mr Paterson has written to the Chief Executive of the RSPCA, the Chief Constable and the Chief Fire Officer about the incident. We now await a response from them...

Edited July 28, 2013 by MarkB

[MarkB 4]

Good grief!

 

There appears to be a problem with the RSPCA.

 

There is no doubt that since 1824 the RSPCA has lead the fight against animal cruelty admirably. For all of its wrinkles and imperfections, the charity has acted as a powerful force on behalf of Britain's animals with prosecutions involving often sickening mistreatment or neglect being entirely justified.

 

Unfortunately in recent years heavy-handed prosecutions by the animal welfare charity are leaving many elderly, vulnerable and often innocent pet owners completely devastated. Caring owners, with the best of intentions and unblemished criminal records, are dragged into the dock when assistance would be more appropriate. Critics claim that the organisation has lost its moral compass and spends far too much time on prosecuting rather than re-housing healthy animals or working with and educating those pet owners who might simply be in need of help or advice. The RSPCA has reduced its use of advice and warning notices to animal owners, from 86,000 in 2010 to 78,000 last year. Unbelievable figures also reveal that the charity destroys nearly half of the animals it rescues each year with thousands being put down for non-medical reasons. Last year 53,000, or 44% of those animals taken in, were destroyed and in the past 2 years alone convictions secured by the charity increased from 2,579 to 3,114. The RSPCA insist that the majority of animals are put down to end their suffering but they also admit that in 2012 alone, 3.400 animals were destroyed for “non-medical” reasons such as lack of space in kennels, catteries etc.

 

Our concern is that Mr Spicer’s healthy dog “Little Boy” might also become one of these sad statistics…

Edited July 28, 2013 by MarkB

[justice 0]

I suspect 'Little Boy' will have been sent to a private boarding kennel (or as the rspca like to call them 'a place of safety') who no doubt are rubbing their hands in glee as they can charge whatever they like.

That mob will make it as difficult as possible for owners to enquire about their animals.

The title of this thread sums it up. It's not just the monetary cost of their actions it's also the human cost. There are at least five suicides that are suspected to have been caused by the r$pca. There is also a gentleman in Wales (Clwyd Davies) who has been missing since April.

[Kaytee 3]

Hi,

John (First time I've ever called him that!) knows I'm trying to contact him - at the moment we are limited to letters. Is anyone willing, able, and of course, prudent enough, to pass a message or two backwards and forwards?

Hope the mods don't mind me posting this but I'm all out of options and I would like to be reassured of his (John's) welfare.

 

Thanks.

Edited March 27, 2014 by Kaytee

[Kaytee 3]

Hi,

If someone could post on here to confirm that John is okay, I'd appreciate it.

Thanks.

[Simple Simon 36]

John is fine

[Kaytee 3]

Thank you.

[MarkB 4]

Kaytee,

           If you are the lady from overseas who wrote to me i passed your letter onto John who was very pleased that you had been in touch. If you wish to write again i am more than happy to pass on your letters or messages to John.

 

A little info about the case and the RSPCA.

 

As im sure you are aware John has been charged on 5 counts by the RSPCA, trial date set for Septermber...

 

My concerns about Johns very healthy younger dog proved correct... The RSPCA had the young healthy dog 'Little Boy' put to sleep last December, exactly 6 months after taking him in. Thats both of Johns dogs now destroyed.

You make your own minds up about this... 

Edited May 13, 2014 by MarkB

[Kaytee 3]

Thanks Mark.

 

Yes, I am the lady from overseas!

 

I've sent him three letters since I last heard from him but had nothing back. Hence I was at my wit's end.

In the last letter he did say, "Little Boy PTS" (Put to Sleep) but I didn't want to mention it on the forum in case I'd got things wrong.

 

I've actually got something to say on this subject - although I'm trying not to rant. 

 

I've known John for 35 years. I worked with him. He was a 150% dedicated vet. He stuck his neck out to save the lives of animals that most vets wouldn't bother to do. They wouldn't even bother trying because they didn't want to draw attention to themselves.

I've seen him strive for a 'cure' for distemper - and this was prior to vaccines being used wholesale - and I also believe, he found it - but he couldn't get the pharmaceutical companies interested. Hell, who would want a cure when every dog owner in the land will pay annually for a vaccine? I also believe he paid a price for sticking his neck out.

 

I've seen him work every hour God sends (10pm on a Friday night, why would anyone feel the need to go home????) and  I've gone with him to Earls Court when we've taken kids on the Duke of Edinburgh Scheme.

 

No, he doesn't live like the 'typical' person, he is eccentric - but it isn't a crime. And he isn't knee deep in mortgages, credit card debt and bothered more about inanimate 'objects' than living, breathing creatures. His priorities are higher than most.

And I honestly don't believe the man has a malicious bone in his body - which is why he can't see it coming when the trivial people show up and start declaring they know the difference between right and wrong.

 

If the courts, or the people who reported him or the RSPCA (they are no longer in my will) see this man as being some kind of demon, then I will leave you with Kierkegaard "There is infinitely more good in the demonic, than in the trivial man."

 

Little Boy is dead because of the trivial people and a good man is being hounded to death. I would say that the trivial people should be ashamed, but it wouldn't make any difference, because they can't look at themselves and judge - they can only judge others.

[justice 0]

I haven't looked on here for a while but am really saddened to read that the rspca are going ahead with a prosecution, although I shouldn't be that surprised, Mr Spicer is the ideal candidate for their bullying tactics.   I hope that those of you who witnessed their raid will attend the trial so you can hear for yourselves (and spread the word) the lies that they will spout in order to get a guilty verdict. 

Words cannot describe my contempt for that organisation, they have lost sight of their original purpose in pursuit of the mighty dollar.

[Kaytee 3]

Just seen the reports of the court case online.

My take on the subject:

 

If I lived in Gobowen I'd be very, very, wary of neighbours who are taking photos - covertly or otherwise.

 

The reporting in both the publications I saw was somewhat misleading. Mainly in that the dog Little Boy was said in court to have "severe mange."  Everyone saw the photos of Little Boy when he was being taken away from the house - does that look like a dog with "Severe Mange?" That dog was killed by the RSPCA.

The report in the Daily Mail said the RSPCA inspector said they were barely recognisable as dogs.

Well, it looks like a BORDER COLLIE to me. If an RSPCA inspector can't recognise this as a dog - then there is no hope.

 

I know that many people in Gobowen will think the situation reflects badly on them - and it does. Because all it goes to show is that when people get old and when they have been independant and are losing that independance, all people do is criticise, judge, blame and attack. I have been to Gobowen and I kinda liked it. A small, close knit, supportive non-judgemental community. At least it was when I was there which was a long time ago.

 

I'm sorry for all concerned. At every level this situation has highlighted the problems with today's culture and mentallity. What happened to a little bit of help is worth a lot of sympathy?

We are getting to be a nation of old people - so remember, next time, it could be you.

 

I wish the residents of Gobowen a peaceful future.

Edited September 25, 2014 by Kaytee

[Robmit 7]

What a dreadfully sad story.   It appears to me that there has been some initial over exuberant reporting and I strongly feel that the RSPCA officials who were involved in this matter should be thoroughly investigated.  I love living in Gobowen and hope the community spirit will grow stronger.